For The Love With Jen Hatmaker Podcast For the Love Podcast
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- Society & Culture
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Welcome to the For the Love Podcast community. New York Times Bestselling author Jen Hatmaker’s life’s work is to lead and serve women as they genuinely show up for their own lives. In these conversations we need not fear the truth, or hard questions, or spiritual curiosity, or challenging unjust systems; that is literally why we are here, and we’re so glad you’ve joined us. We believe women living in freedom are the answer to all that ails society. When we are exactly who we are, how we are, where we are, as we were always meant to be, women are the 8th wonders of the world. For the love of all that is good, right, wrong, hard, fun, perplexing, wondrous and thought-provoking, Jen’s here for it all with eye-opening conversations with some of the best people on earth.
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Kobe Campbell on Gently Excavating Our Trauma
We’re finishing up our For the Love of Wonderful You series intentionally with a deep breath and a gentle word of encouragement. In this episode, even though we are talking about trauma, critical inner voices, and the arduous process of grief, Jen and her guest unwind these topics in the most gentle and loving way.
Kobe Campbell is an award-winning therapist who specializes in helping people process grief and trauma in a way that unearths true empowerment. Hidden beneath the clamor of everyday life, the voices of our inner critic lie in wait to echo our grief. These voices, though silent to others, can roar deafeningly within us — shaping our perceptions, beliefs, and actions. Kobe’s suggestions of journal “prompts” help guide our own trauma excavation process, and her gentle but challenging questions further that sometimes painful work, while steering us toward self compassion.
Jen and Kobe touch on:
The understanding that grief can take a lot of time to process; which can ultimately lead to wisdom and true empowerment
A working definition of trauma and that trauma is highly personal and contextual
How we can feel brave enough to examine the inner critical voice and discern where it’s coming from
Acknowledging the cultural pressure to live at an unsustainable pace that doesn’t allow space or time to heal
If you ever needed permission to grieve or drop the unrelenting pace of your life, then this is the invitation.
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Thought-Provoking Quotes:
“I love to tell people that trauma is not what happened to you. It's about how it affected you. And those effects can live in our present, even if the moment is in the past. I help people parse through that in creative ways with poems, quick words, and thoughts from my kitchen right after I'm done with the session.” - Kobe Campbell
“I think that many of us have not been given the space to grieve long enough to know what genuine and internal empowerment feels like, and we keep trying to give ourselves that empowerment from the outside. We keep trying to grasp motivation from somewhere.” - Kobe Campbell
"Trauma can be acute, meaning it can be a moment, or trauma can be chronic, meaning it could be several moments over time. And I like to give the example that trauma can be a boulder or it could be pebbles. But the reality is–it doesn't matter. There is no big 'T' trauma and little 't' trauma because, at the end of the day, all those pebbles amass to the size of a boulder anyway. It's just being accumulated over time." - Kobe Campbell
"The person who holds the wound holds the wisdom. If we lock away that version of us that is deeply wounded and wants to cry for three months, then we're also locking away the wisdom of those situations that we need for our present." - Kobe Campbell
"My humanity is good. God created it good. And if I believed that I was good for just existing as I am, how would I treat myself?" - Kobe Campbell
Resources Mentioned in This Episode:
Why Am I Like This? How to Break Cycles, Heal From Trauma, and Restore Your Faith by Kobe Campbell
Journal Prompt on Kobe’s Instagram
Brain Neuro Coupling
I Feel Like Woman by Shania Twain on Spotify
Minaa B. Website (Therapist and Colleague of Kobe’s)
I Know Why the Caged Bird Sings by Maya Angelou
Michell C. Clark Instagram
Guest’s Links:
Kobe’s Website
Kobe’s Facebook
Kobe’s Twitter
Kobe’s Instagram
Kobe’s TikTok
Kobe’s YouTube
Connect with Jen!
Jen’s website
Jen’s Instagram
Jen’s Twitter
Jen’s Facebook
Jen’s YouTube
The For the Love Podcast is a production of Four Eyes Media, presented by Audacy.
Four Eyes Media: https://www.iiiimedia.com/
To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy
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Celeste Barber on the Beauty of Being Totally Unfiltered
We’ve got someone on the show this week who makes it her business to show us exactly how wonderful we as women are–just as we are! She is the queen of keeping it real, a hilariously honest actress, standup comedian, and the Instagram star who has become our go-to for a belly laugh when the world's expectations just seem a tad too polished–it’s Celeste Barber!
If you haven’t seen Celeste on her Instagram account, get on over there and join the nearly 10 million people who are clamoring for her content each week (and if you have any doubt, she won the “Funniest Lady on Instagram Award” back in 2017). She’s also a successful standup comedian who sold out three seasons of her “Challenge Accepted” Tour in the US, and has a Netflix Special (“Fine, Thanks”) and a dramatic comedy series that we just love called “Wellmania.”
Jen and Celeste get into it about:
The riotous juggle Celeste manages by shining a light on the quirks of the beauty industry, all while paving her own extraordinary path.
Celeste opens up about the nuanced battles of being valued for her sharp mind and quicker wit in a scene often unforgiving to women.
Celeste and Jen share about the beautiful chaos of balancing a career with being a superhero mom (or at least trying to be).
This episode is more than just laughs (though, swear, you'll have plenty); it's a pat on the back for every one of us out here, doing the thing, being utterly magnificent in our complexity. Here’s to celebrating the splendid and wonderful you!
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Thought-Provoking Quotes:
“I would like to live one day without anxiety. I would also like to be a Janet Jackson backup dancer. That's all I ask for.” - Celeste Barber
“I take my hat off to women in general, just always and forever.
"The mothers who work in the day and then go home and be excellent mothers at night, and they go back to work in the day and they come home and they're excellent mothers. How do they do that?” - Celeste Barber
“With women, [being] funny or smart or boundary-pushing is fine as an idea, but [we're asked] 'can you be safe and pretty because that's just easier for us.' And so shifting that lens, the thing is, we're multifaceted. There are so many different types of things to celebrate within women." - Celeste Barber
Resources Mentioned in This Episode:
Celeste Barber: Challenge Accepted (Celeste’s 2019 Comedy Special)
Celeste Barber: Fine, Thanks (Celeste’s 2023 Comedy Special)
All Saints (Medical Drama that got Celeste her start)
Wellmania (2023 Netflix Series Starring Celeste)
Celeste Barber: Backup Dancer Tour
Celeste Barber and Tom Ford Collab
Celeste will be in Dallas June 10th at the Majestic Theatre, in Austin June 13th at the Paramount Theatre, and in Houston June 14th at 713 Music Hall
Guest’s Links:
Celeste’s Website
Celeste’s Instagram
Celeste’s Facebook
Celeste’s Twitter
Celeste’s YouTube Channel
Connect with Jen!
Jen’s website
Jen’s Instagram
Jen’s Twitter
Jen’s Facebook
Jen’s YouTube
The For the Love Podcast is a production of Four Eyes Media, presented by Audacy.
Visit Four Eyes Media: https://www.iiiimedia.com/
To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices -
Introducing: We Can Do Hard Things Podcast
Here’s a little bonus for all our listeners this week–a preview from one of our fellow Audcacy Network podcasts, We Can Do Hard Things! Life is freaking hard. We are all doing hard things every single day – things like loving and losing; caring for children and parents; forging and ending friendships; battling addiction, illness, and loneliness; struggling in our jobs, our marriages, and our divorces; setting boundaries; and fighting for equality, purpose, freedom, joy, and peace. On We Can Do Hard Things, Glennon Doyle, author of UNTAMED; her wife Abby Wambach; and her sister Amanda Doyle do the only thing they’ve found that has ever made life easier: Drop the fake and talk honestly about the hard things including sex, gender, parenting, blended families, bodies, anxiety, addiction, justice, boundaries, fun, quitting, overwhelm . . . all of it. We laugh and cry and help each other carry the hard so we can all live a little bit lighter and braver, free-er, less alone.
Enjoy this special excerpt from We Can Do Hard Things!
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Connect with Our Friends!
We Can Do Hard Things Podcast
Nadia Bolz-Weber
Connect with Jen!
Jen’s website
Jen’s Instagram
Jen’s Twitter
Jen’s Facebook
Jen’s YouTube
To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy
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Amanda Doyle Stops Keeping Score And Stays In The Moment
It’s the start of a new series, For The Love of Wonderful You! Spring is arriving and as the winter slumber fades away, many of us are likely plunging into a frantic pace of commitments and To Do lists. But we want to take a minute (or approximately 45-mins to an hour) to create a moment where we can punch the brakes a little. Let’s tell that inner taskmaster to relax; and instead, reflect on finding value in who we are in this moment, and how worthy we are just as we are.
Jen’s amazing conversation partner today is Amanda Doyle. Amanda is many amazing things but you may know her first and foremost as “Sister” on the We Can Do Hard Things Podcast with Glennon Doyle and Abby Wambach. She’s also part of the leadership team at Together Rising, the amazing non-profit that has raised over $50 million dollars and given it away to people all over the world who need it most. Amanda has been a longtime social justice advocate and she uses that knowledge to break down deep truths and complex social issues in all her conversations. Today, she reminds us that spending the energy to stay vulnerable in our relationships will always pay out.
In this episode Jen and Amanda talk about:
The struggle to be vulnerable and truly open up versus managing perceptions and staying in control in relationships
How Amanda chose sobriety and the surprising clarity that emerged in her marriage, especially during the pandemic
Jen’s journey to understanding herself and her avoidant tendencies in the aftermath of her divorce
The profound impact of the "love letter" exercise guided by Liz Gilbert, where “Love's voice” urged Amanda to stop keeping score in life
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Thought-Provoking Quotes:
“A relationship has to have some equilibrium. The farther you go this way, the more the other person has to go the other way. What I have learned is that no one wants to be in those places.” - Amanda Doyle
"What I have recently realized is that many people who either view themselves or are viewed in their relationships as control freaks; actually what they want the most is to not be in control of everything. They feel like they have to be in control of everything, because that is the way that they show their love is by taking care of things. But what they want more than anything else is for someone to step up and be like, 'I got this, I got you. You don't have to be in control of this.'" - Amanda Doyle
“You are so fixated on the score of this life, but there is no score except the one in your head. You are exhausting yourself to death, trying to keep a score and figure out where you've won, and figure out where other people have disappointed you and slighted you and not met your expectations. But the score is fiction. We're not being scored." - Amanda Doyle
“We think when we're giving up alcohol, we're giving up fun. And that's with good reason. It's like fully marketed--growing up, it's part of the narrative; anything that is fun also includes alcohol. But then I had the enormous blessing of being so close to Abby and Glennon's life and seeing that they were the most fun people with the most delightful, satisfying lives of anyone else I know. And none of that included alcohol." - Amanda Doyle
Resources Mentioned in This Episode:
We Can Do Hard Things with Glennon Doyle
For the Love Podcast Episode ft. Glennon Doyle
For the Love Podcast Episode ft. Abby Wambach
For the Love Podcast Enneagram Threes Episode ft. Lisa Whelchel
Untamed by Glennon Doyle
We Can Do Hard Thing Episode ft. Liz Gilbert
Letters From Love with Liz Gilbert (Substack)
For the Love Podcast Episode ft. Sarah Bessey
Guest’s Links:
Together Rising Website
Amanda’s Twitter
Together Rising Facebook
Together Rising Instagram
Connect with Jen!
Jen’s website
Jen’s Instagram
Jen’s Twitter
Jen’s Facebook
Jen’s YouTube
The For the Love Podcast is a production of Four Eyes Media, presented by Audacy.
Four Eyes Media: https://www.iiiimedia.com/
To learn more -
[BONUS] Jen Hatmaker Book Club ft. Take My Hand by Dolen Perkins-Valdez
For this month’s book club pick, we are headed into 1970’s Montgomery, Alabama. Based on a true story, Take My Hand by Dolen Perkins-Valdez is an unflinching exploration of accountability and redemption through an era that was plagued with bias and coercion. The central character, Civil Townsend, is a complicated heroine fresh out of nursing school with a deep desire to make a difference in her Black community at the Montgomery Family Planning Clinic. During her first week on the job, Civil encounters two young girls who have their agency usurped by the current government authority which mandates that because they Black, poor, and disabled, the girls’ ability to have children should be curbed. Years later, Civil Townsend must reconcile her role and complicity in a story that must not be forgotten.What unfolds is a shocking and heartbreaking expose of how girls and women have had their agency taken away in ways that echo for generations.
Inspired by true events, Dolen recounts her research process and how she wanted to write “bruised characters” that evoke outrage and empathy. Jen and Dolen dive into Dolen’s history as a writer, the context of what was happening in 1973 when the case that this story is based broke into the public sphere, and all the themes of this book that make it impossible to put down. This is a story that must not be forgotten and Dolen writes it so you won’t ever forget.
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Guest’s Links:
Dolen’s Website
Dolen’s Facebook
Dolen’s Twitter
Dolen’s Instagram
Books & Resources Mentioned in This Episode:
Take My Hand by Dolen Perkins-Valdez
Balm by Dolen Perkins-Valdez
Wench by Dolen Perkins-Valdez
Relp v. Weinberger Case
Roe v. Wade Case
Brotherless Night by V. V. Ganeshananthan
Symphony of Secrets by Brendan Slocumb
Happiness Falls by Angie Kim
Connect with Jen!
Jen’s website - http://jenhatmaker.com/
Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker
Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/
Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker
Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker?sub_confirmation=1
The For the Love Podcast is a production of Four Eyes Media, presented by Audacy.
Four Eyes Media: https://www.iiiimedia.com/
To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices -
Sparking Change In America: Joy Reid Calls Out Injustice Everywhere
We’re wrapping up our series featuring Black Trailblazers, and we couldn’t be more thrilled to have another guest who has broken barriers and basically created their own space as part of the national conversation, becoming the first black woman to anchor a cable primetime show. You may know her from her seat as a political analyst on MSNBC, or as the host of her own show, The ReidOut. It’s the amazing Joy Reid, everyone! Joy is a Harvard grad with a degree in visual and environmental studies and a concentration in documentary film. She also worked on the Florida branch of the Obama campaign. Her political writing prowess has landed her columns and articles everywhere; The New York Times, The New Republic, The Guardian, The Daily Beast, and The New Yorker, to name a few. PLUS she has a new book coming out that she gives us a special peek into; it’s the important and moving story of slain Civil rights pioneer Medgar Evers and his wife Myrlie, also an activist. It's not every day we get to talk to someone who brings the goods about so many profound topics—civil rights, the fight for reproductive rights, immigration issues, the sacrifice for equality—and she and Jen shy away from none of them here. Joy’s passion for calling out injustice and her unwavering belief that we all hold the keys to preserving our rights and our freedoms gives us a reason to believe that we all can be trailblazers toward sparking change in our world.
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Thought-Provoking Quotes:
“I'm very conscious of the fact that I'm the person that looks like the young black girls who come up to me, and it makes me feel very proud because I can represent. You really can only be what you can see.” - Joy Reid
“The goal is when you get in the door, just pop it open. Get it open and let more people in. Diversity and equity and inclusion, they’ve become bad words. But they actually just mean we’re making America more what it was meant to be.” - Joy Reid
“The immigrants who people are fighting hardest against are the people who are coming from Guatemala and El Salvador. They're also coming from China and Ukraine at this point. All they want to do is work. They are probably the hardest working people in America.” - Joy Reid
“We keep trying to replace cheap labor. America could change that by paying people living wages. But Americans don't want to do that. We love the cheap labor because we love the cheap chicken sandwiches.” - Joy Reid
“We have to save ourselves not just by voting for president, but by choosing the Senate in a different way, by choosing a different House of Representatives, by choosing different state legislatures, different governors. You need to start choosing not based on the party you're loyal to and the jersey you put on at age 18 when you became a Republican or a Democrat. You need to choose based on who's going to let you be free.” - Joy Reid
Joy’s Links:
The ReidOut - Joy’s show on MSNBC
Joy Reid - Instagram
Joy Reid - Facebook
Joy Reid - X (Twitter)
Books & Resources Mentioned in This Episode:
The Man Who Sold America Trump And The Unraveling of The American Story - book by Joy Reid
Medgar and Myrlie: Medgar Evers and the Love Story That Wakened America - book by Joy Reid
T.R.M. Howard - Black Physician Who Created a System of Affordable Health Care
Legislation in Georgia Regarding a Six Week Abortion Ban
Meet the Press News Show
Gwen Ifill - American Journalist
Medgar & Myrlie Evers - Civil Rights Pioneers
Queen & Slim - Film
Manning Marable - Professor African American Studies/Columbia University
Emmitt Till’s Photo in Jet Magazine
Sharon McMahon Instagram
Connect with Jen!
Jen’s website
Jen’s Instagram
Jen’s Twitter
Jen’s Facebook
Jen’s YouTube
To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices
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